February 2012 Minutes

Har-Ber Meadows POA Board Meeting

February 27, 2012


Meeting called order at 6:35 pm by President Jason Combs.


Attending were Jason Combs, Judy Hammond, Tommy Hensen, Jerry Martin, Clay Galloway, George Kelly, Ralph Gresham. Also present were: John Duke, Property Manager; Alicia Hines, Treasurer; Donnie Rutledge, Attorney; Tom Jefcoat, Matt Baker, ARC.

Declaration of Quorum

Donnie Rutledge updated the Board on the lawsuit against DTS to stop construction on 5670 Dancing Rabbit regarding the driveway and retaining wall.

Scheduled to have hearing on Wednesday the 29th at 2:00 pm for an injunction on construction at this address. At the “11th hour” – today – started getting communication from DTS’s attorney, they proposed a settlement offer. Offer is 2 parts –

  1. We approve their current plans for 5670 Dancing Rabbit (lot 8) and approve application that they will re-submit for 5750 Dancing Rabbit (was submitted on 1/27/12 and rejected due to a lack of site plan and proper landscaping plan) within 48 hours which was previously denied by the ARC due to incomplete submission. Current plans for lot 8 are no retaining wall – city required this to be removed since it was built over water and sewer lines, driveway will have landscaping angled down to ground level at approximate 45 degree angle. Driveway will be 5 feet from property line on west side. As driveway moves toward the street it will encroach on property line to the west closer than the required 2 feet, but there is no other way around this, this is the only way to keep the current house structure.
  2. We walk away from Gilbert-Hardy driveway issue and allow it to remain as is, and DTS agrees to sell its 6 remaining lots in Har-Ber Meadows.

Concerns were voiced regarding the sloped landscaping from the edge of the driveway for 5670 Dancing Rabbit, the angle of the slope and its ability to withstand weathering and erosion. Discussions ensued regarding whether we include Gilbert-Hardy driveway in our settlement or not. Most recent communication with Gilbert-Hardy/Brodbeck regarding the driveway was the letter Donnie sent to their attorney stating the 14 day deadline to initiate driveway modification that was agreed to, March 2nd is the 14 day deadline.   Tom Jefcoat pointed out that DTS built a wooden privacy fence on the property to the east of 847 Clinton Circle (Gilbert-Hardy property) without submitting an ARC application for approval.

Donnie informed DTS’ attorney today that he would present the offer to the Board and that we would be able to rule out the settlement, or approve to work toward a settlement that would be contingent on a professionally drawn site plan and questions about the sloped landscaping along the driveway for lot 8 at 5670 Dancing Rabbit.


Discussion continued about the Gilbert-Hardy driveway. Donnie advised that if we keep this driveway out of the DTS settlement and filed suit against Gilbert-Hardy to remedy the driveway that he thought we could reach a settlement without going to court.

Matt Baker asked if DTS thought that we wanted them to sell their remaining 6 lots and pull out of the neighborhood. Donnie stated that he thought that part of their offer had to do with them being tired of dealing with the ARC and POA Board and was their way of avoiding dealing with us any further. Tom stated the ARC doesn’t care if DTS sells their other lots, or not. They are not against DTS as a builder, they just want DTS to follow the rules and guidelines in the builder’s guide and covenants. Matt stated he would rather them fix the Gilbert-Hardy driveway and keep their lots and build on them while following the rules. Ralph pointed out that insisting DTS remedy the Gilbert-Hardy driveway and allowing them to keep their 6 lots would save DTS a lot of money.

Donnie stated that this much work at the last minute is normal procedure for lawsuits, nothing to be concerned about, this is the time for deals to get worked out. If we go to court, Donnie thinks at the least the judge would grant us   ????????

Jason asked if we could offer a counter proposal to DTS’ offer, Donnie said yes. Jason said we should offer a counter proposal, do what DTS said they would with lots 8 and 6, keep the remaining 6 lots and build on them, agree to a court order requiring DTS follow our guidelines and waiting for ARC approval and building only to approved plans.

Donnie went back to the Gilbert-Hardy driveway stating that we had every indication they were going to fix the driveway, but when he asked when it would get underway, Mr. Brodbeck said he was waiting on DTS to get back with him, which upset him some.

Alicia stated that DTS has not paid their 2012 dues on any of their 8 lots they currently own; that we ask for the $4,000 in dues on their lots as part of our offer.

Jason Combs moved that the POA Board accepts the offer from DTS for approval of the structure on lot 8 with the driveway as drawn on the updated site plan and sloped landscaping for 5670 Dancing Rabbit, give them a response within 48 hours on lot 6, they sell their remaining 6 lots, pay the 2012 dues in full on their 8 lots, submit an application for the privacy fence built on the lot next door to Gilbert-Hardy, but that the Gilbert-Hardy driveway is kept out of the settlement.

Jerry stated he would vote against it due to a lack of a detailed plan on the landscaping for lot 8 driveway and because the Gilbert-Hardy driveway was not part of the settlement.

George seconded Jason’s motion. Motion passed 5-2.

Donnie stated that for lot 8, he thought there would be questions to be answered that were not addressed. Donnie said he did not feel good about approving the hand-drawn plan for lot 8 that we had given.

Judy moved to amend the approved motion to include a better drawing to show slopes, angles, plant material and others to be approved by the ARC; Donnie intervened said that he would like to go back to DTS and tell them that we are open to the plan, would meet Tuesday night and come up with a list of the requirements and questions for DTS to answer so that ARC could review and approve plan.


Judy re-worded her motion to amend the approved motion that our settlement offer would require further documentation supplied by DTS as requested by the ARC, that they would review what was received and that the ARC would give them a response within 48 hours. Jason Combs seconded the motion which passed 7-0.

Ralph Gresham asked Donnie about DTS rejecting our offer and going to court, Donnie stated that DTS would be likely argue their case using the existing violations, which they would be required to find and supply evidence of.

Matt Baker suggested allowing Donnie some bargaining chips for negotiating a settlement if needed, mainly DTS is allowed to keep their 6 lots and build on them according to our guidelines with ARC approval. Discussion ensued that maybe we can use the lots as a bargaining chip to get DTS to remedy the Gilbert-Hardy driveway to what we proposed to the home owner which was remove 4 feet off of the east side, sandblast the surface and return it to a natural concrete color, and re-curb the street. A collective agreement to Matt’s suggestion was understood and permission was given to Donnie to negotiate with DTS and their attorney as needed to reach a settlement that is in the best interest of the POA.

Remaining ARC update presented by Tom Jefcoat – there is an ornamental fence that they do not have an application for. The Athletes Plus company that has taken over the Spa Estiques commercial space has put up two signs with no application or approval. The Athletes Plus sign is okay and would be approved, the Physical Therapy sign that is hung underneath it is an eyesore and would not be approved, they need to take it down. No other ARC items.

Resident concerns – the New Hope Church being built across 56th Street from the Har-Ber Meadows west side entrance, do they have proper drainage for their lot? Jason stated that property is not part of Har-Ber Meadows and we don’t have any control over it, but that the city should make the church follow proper drainage and water flow guidelines. The storm water from the church would end up in the creek that flows through Francis Fair park and on through the Brush Creek Golf Course and end up in Lake Elmdale.

January Minutes presented by Jason Combs – there were a few changes made by Nancy after she sent out the first draft to the board members. The updated minutes are what we have attached to the packets that Alicia printed off and brought to the meeting. Jerry Martin moved to approve the January minutes, seconded by Judy Hammond. Motion was approved 7-0, minutes signed by President Jason Combs and given to John to give to Nancy to file.

January financial update presented by Alicia Hines – during January we received 2 credit card payments that went to our newly created Signature Bank account. Since January there have been several more credit card payments, but they are not reflected on the January financial statements. Some residents have questions about where to mail their checks for dues, Alicia has some try to drop them off at her house, but has told residents she cannot accept them in that form, they must be mailed to our P.O. Box. Expenses are in line with expectations. Invoice for $1,400 for cleaning the pool house for 2011 was not submitted until January, so we have pool expenses listed for January. The invoicing for the pool house cleaning will now be sent to us monthly. $139 collected in past due items from 2011. Current insurance coverages paid for by the POA have been attached to the packets that Alicia printed out. Alicia questioned Mike Lutrell if the POA coverage was sufficient. Mike said that the Board members and Officer’s insurance was sufficient. Our property coverage is split between facilities and property to give us the most coverage for the least amount of price, part of it is under Philadelphia – parks and green space, signs, equipment, pool, fences, outdoor pool furniture, pool cover, lakes, bridges, etc. which is $1 million with a $2 million limit. State Auto covers the pool building, furniture inside the pool building, and Crumpacker park pavilion. Should we consider increasing our $2 million limit for claims within a year? Consensus was no, we are good, we have very few claims per year for small amounts. Clay asked if we bid our insurance or if we just give it to Walker Brothers every year. Explanation was given that we do not bid it out, that Mike is a past board member and president and has been a long time resident of Har-Ber Meadows and owns commercial property as well, has a vested interest to do work in the best interest of the neighborhood. George moved to approve the January financials, seconded by Jerry Martin, motion passed 7-0.

Security committee update presented by Tommy Hensen – the Church of Latter Day Saints has been vandalized, the police think it may be a former parishioner. Alicia stated that windows were broken, human feces were used to write derogatory words on the walls. The police department has considered the vandalism a hate crime, has increased their patrols through the neighborhood. No other security updates.

Lakes committee update presented by Ralph Gresham – he and Jerry met with the person that serviced the pump, it has been re-packed properly, removed a rag that was used to pack it previously, greased the bearings, found an air-release valve that was leaking which has been taken in for repairs (may have to replace air-release valve). Ralph asked if we had interest in under water lights to light up the fountains at night, he is working on a project for another party and thinks we can get lights fairly cheap un-installed. Ralph also thinks we could use the same lights for tree up-lighting. We would just need to get an electrician to run wires to the lines. Jason Combs pulled up our proposal from Get Lit from the Fall which stated that we could get up-lighting on trees for 6 trees for less than $3500, a little less than $600 per tree, would include electricity, photo cells, and more. Back to lakes, no plans for additional carp. Ralph will need some more lake chemicals, probably $200 worth for the year.

Landscape and Facilities committee presented by George Kelly – the bulletin board has been installed on the front of the pool building for slightly less than the approved expense. The electrical line to the lights for the 56th street sign is still being remedied. The fence on Jones Road has been completed, cost was equal to the bid price, nothing else to report.

Matt Baker emailed about doing some work to fix up the baseball field, manicure the base paths, replace home plate, aerate the infield, and build up the pitcher’s mound. All-Around’s contract calls for them to remove grass and weeds from the base paths and put a fresh layer of red clay down. We need to get the field upgraded prior to the field being used for little league practices. John is going to get All-Around out to do their contracted maintenance.

Jason Combs moved to give John Duke up to $250 to spend on materials and services to fix up home plate, raising the pitching mound, and buying and installing a new home plate in addition to the All-Around contracted maintenance, motion seconded by Judy Hammond. Motion passed 7-0.

George Kelly proposed planting white pine trees in the Francis Fair Park green space that borders Donnie Rutledge’s property where the solar panels are located in order to screen the panels from 56th Street and Francis Fair Parkway. George says he thinks 15 of the white pines will be sufficient, he can get them for $150 per tree, a total of $2250 which includes the planting, each tree would be 7-8 feet tall. The white pines will grow to 20-25 feet tall. George has put orange flag markers where he thinks the trees should be placed, between the creek and Donnie’s property line, about 40 feet on the park side of the property line and about 75 feet from the solar panels. George also proposed that we sell our maintenance golf cart, and with the money, purchase a trailer and 325 gallon tank with valves and pipes necessary to water trees. It could be parked where the golf cart currently sits. Ralph Gresham proposed that we add up to 10 white pine trees to put around the lakes along JTL Parkway to replace trees we have lost in the last few years. Questions about funding the trees came up. The January financials show $5100 left, Alicia stated that the Jones Road Fence and bulletin board were not subtracted from the capital improvement fund. Accounting for those expenses we have about $1000 left in our designated sinking fund. Funding for the trees, trailer, and water tank would come from cash in the bank once the designated fund was spent. Jason Combs moved that we use cash in the bank to purchase up to 20 white pines for $3000 to place in Francis Fair Park to screen the solar panels and to place around the lakes on JTL, sell the golf cart, purchase a 5’x8’ trailer and 325 gallon tank for $900 to water the trees with. Motion seconded by Clay, motion passed 7-0. John Duke has a guy that he will talk to about buying our golf cart.

Capital improvement items: tree up-lighting and fountain lights – Ralph will get an estimate on the lights for trees and fountains. The Carol Lake platform enclosure – John has some ideas from the past, but no hard numbers or designs. Jason Combs mentioned a wooden privacy fence as the most inexpensive option. John is going to put new high voltage danger signs on the platform, we are in need of a new lock for the gate. Jason asked John to get bids for an 8 foot wooden fence with a single gate to enclose the Carol Lake platform.

Annual Meeting Coming Up – 3 1-year term appointments: Judy, Clay, and Jerry; two 4-year terms are expiring, Ralph and Jason. Jason appointed the entire 10 member Board to the Nominating Committee. Jason will post an announcement and send out an email blast soliciting residents interested in serving on the Board.

John Duke wants board to consider some things for the next meeting: new pool equipment, wi-fi for the pool building during the pool season; do a 6-month internet deal during pool season only.

Ralph got a call from a resident asking for an afterhours adults only pool-time. Alicia responded that when we did this in the past we had a very hard time getting the families to leave when having adults only swim time ran consecutively with the normal swimming pool hours. Also have issues with getting people to leave at 9:00 when the pool closes as is, we should ask residents to be ready to leave at 9:00 because we have to pay for the attendants to stay.

Residents that are members of New Hope Church proposed to have the church host the Easter egg hunt for the entire neighborhood this year only. Board felt like it would interfere with our current volunteer Easter egg hunt that has worked well in the past, however, we would offer to let them use our other parks for their church only Easter egg hunt.

George mentioned the by-laws require the board to meet within 10 days after the annual meeting, but we’ve not done that for the last few years.

Clay had to leave the meeting.

Judy Hammond moved to host the annual meeting on Monday May 24th and to have a Board meeting the next night, Tuesday May 25th, seconded by Jason Combs. Motion passed 6-0, Clay and John will work on the sponsors for the annual meeting between now and the next monthly meeting and will bring a list of what is done and to-do’s still needing done.


Judy and Jerry expressed interest in running for board positions again, Jason officially nominated them both as candidates for board election.

Jason Combs made motion to adjourn, seconded by Judy Hammond. Motion passed 6-0.

Meeting adjourned at 9:00 pm.


Respectfully submitted this 26th day of March 2012.





Jason Combs, President





Nancy Owens, Secretary





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